Fandom : Can it prove disastrous to your development ?

Kools, there is a difference between being a 'fan' and the extreme fandom you are talking about. In I-F, the extreme fandom which made people non-objective, mean and crazy are called 'fangirls'. It does not mean anything bad as such, but on IF it means you are badly and madly crazy.

A fan-- he or she is a person who admires any celebrity or famous personality for a trait, talent, goodness of character, looks or any other thing.

I would not call fandom useless for many reasons.

1.) A fanbase is what makes or breaks a star in many instances Rajeev Khandelwal could survive in the Ekta camp for so long only cos he had loyal fans. Once he was thrown over, there were rumours that Ekta had told all channels she didn't want them to offer shows to Rajeev. But channels were willing to take a risk cos they knew Rajeev had a very dedicated fanbase- a fan base which watched the show at 11 o clock just to see their star, the fanbase which had boycotted KTH after he quit it, the fan base which made KTH a flop after he quit. His fanbase (telling with experience over my years in I-F) rests mostly in India and Pakistan, and over most of South East Asia.

Counting on his fanbase, they offered him shows. Rajeev is still doing some shows on TV and is in demand even though he is doing movies as well.

Salman Khan has his set of loyal fans, not only for his films, but also for his general goodness of character. Media knows people love Salman for the charity work he does. And so they make it a point to raise it and thus never let Salman die out even when his films are not doing well. Fans ensure you stability.

2.) Constructive criticism
No critic can give as good constructive criticism as a fan can. Many actos reinvent themselves solely cos of the criticism they get. In fact the main reason many actors secretly have links with people in forums is that they want feedback and want to popular they really are.
Since the fans follow each aspect of a star closely and witness ALL performances, they can give good feedback, unlike a critic who may have watched one film, and not everyone.
During JDJ and ZNKD, we used to analyse Sushant's dances- dissect it, discuss which step he did well, and which he did not, and so on... even the clothes that make him look less tummy-licious!! It was done cos Sushant had links and he used to visit that appreciation thread to get feedback, this is what we were told.

3.) Encouragement:
A growing fan base is indirectly an indication of the success of an actor. It is what makes him a star. It pushes him to do his best. Sushant always said he tried to push the envelope in JDJ cos he was getting encouraged by a lot of fans.

4.) And most importantly:

ITS FUN!!!

When we pamper our loved ones excessively by protecting them when they are wrong, praising them to no end, hiding their flaws and causing wrong to others, it does not mean love is wrong. It just means that we are choosing the wrong ways and means to show our love, it is MISGUIDED. Blind love is not love.

Similarily blind support is not support. It is important to maintain objectivity if you actually want your star to prosper. What my Mom says is cent percent correct-- she says people fall for the look and characterization of the TV characters and treat these people like stars, consequently they stop improvising. Most of the TV actors these days are pathetic with the dialogue delivery and they make me cringe when they cry, but unko yeh kaun bataye???

Any thing in excess becomes a poison- and adoration which goes to the level of blind worship is in long term, is actually detrimental, not only to the star, but to forum members.

On I-F extreme fandom is referred to as 'fangirl'ism. They are the kind who make it a mission to make their favourite top the ranking polls at I-F, they vote and comment day and night. (For those who wonder why Sushant's ranking is so low inspite of being the topmost actors on TV--- its cos he doesn't have 'fangirls', he has fans. In fact he has the most lazy fans, who don't comment at all )

These fangirls do everything you mentioned in your post Kools and more.

Some lose objectivity so badly that they try to make excuses for their favourite's pathetic behavior like cheating on three women at one time or cheating his wife. That is the worst.

Others praise the star so much, even when he is not doing well, simply cos they have lost ability to judge. Thus the star never gets constructive criticism which is actually what a fan should do.

At the end of the day, I don't find anything wrong in being a fan. Its an adoration and appreciation for a person or his talent. But as we say, everything must stay in its limits. Adoration going out of hand makes people weak and susceptible to any kind of nonsense behavior and loss of ethics. It crosses heights of obsessiveness.

In healthy limits, all is well. It feels nice to support the one who entertains you by showing some love and supporting them when someone tries to sling mud on their image. (This happened in JDJ forum-- someone made posts about how Sushant was a GF-beating, alcoholic snob and Ankita was a girl who made teeny weeny clothes and was from a bad background. She even posted articles on this. It was we fans who clarified that she had made up all that stuff and it was all wrong. I-F is a popular portal. News from here leaks to FB, and many other forums. Who knew what the outcome could have been? Fans could identify she was wrong and spreading incorrect info cos we have been following Sushant Ankita's articles since 2 years now)

I believe supporting true talent actually helps you understand it better. And so I don't find fandom disasterous to OUR development, until it gets out of hand. In fact, it can also make you more receptive to discussions and analogy, as it did to me. When you clash with someone who is NOT fan, then the way you explain and handle the situation is a skill which is learned with difficulty in life. It can go a long way ahead in shaping personality.

I personally have gained a lot by being a fan:
1.) I got to know more about dance.
2.) Reading
3.) improved PR skills (How to convey your ideas without bashing)
4.) Understood a bit about the way this industry works due to 'sources'
5.) Rajeev Khandelwal agreed to come to our college for our college function cos he got impressed by the mail I sent to him (He said it to me himself when I met him) . I requested him to come saying that the theme was global warming, and as he had given come quotes on the same a few years ago in Mid-day and practised anti-global warming measures, he was a good role model. He was impressed by his popularity, my being his big fan, and his praise as well as the genuine cause and agreed to come.
6.) I discovered hidden skills in myself- I never thought I would be writing a story and so many people would be reading it.

I will add more to the list

kools i agree wid what u say abt crazy fans..i have seen umpteen number of such "fans" who just cnt look beyond their fav actor..no matter what he/she does on screen..so much so tht other members are targetted,fan groups start ridiculous fights,name-calling,below-the-belt comments..u name it,its there...
since its not IF,i can name the forum here..if its not allowed,ur free to edit my post..the UT forum on IF is one such forum which got so much out of hand tht i quit..its impossible to have a decent conversation there widout the opposite fan group targetting u..and all for the pretty face playing the negative role there..so much so tht the other lead had been labelled as a w**** who slept arnd,it had been blatantly stated tht servants are fit to be only used and not be treated like family,etc etc...its a wonder tht nobody even had the insight to see what kind of people they came across as..
like niki said,this is not being a fan..its being a fanatic..fans are the best critics..fanatics are the ones who have amazing blinders on and refuse to see the character objectively..even if its my fav actor or fav show,if the character is having a stupid track,i shud have the objectivity to see it as it is..if i dnt,thn there is no point of having a working brain..personally,i have always been attracted to gray characters coz they are the only "normal" people on screen..and my bad luck is tht they are ALWAYS converted to outright evil ones just coz they dnt worship the saintly leads..its annoying u know..i dnt get attached to any character now for the exact same reason..

Super question di I m so exciting to hear all's review!
@niki 3 cheers to ur post Each & every word correct

I cant tell tat much in this coz i havent experienced it but would love to read all's POV here.
When di had faced such situation i wasnt even der at forum [PC probz]& wen i was back i came to knw abt X & her posts. OMG i hated her! saath mein vo A aur B all getting involve to get rid of di 4m tat forum! Man she had d gall to shut down di's thread i hate her till now Aur abhi gayab hai I have been only in PR forum so from wat i knw only A fans r fanatic der! They just cant see beyond their lovely A M fans sab theek thak hai! I dun knw how dey survive der!

niki I JUST lost a detailed post I typed to give u MY view on what i feel . I dont have the energy or time now to retype it .

U have defended ur views very well .

Guys please don't mention members names from any forum . If u want to relate a specific esperience to prove ur point use alphabets XYZ or ABC .Bas . Yes u can say CB forum or PR forum or Pratigya forum . Thats ok .

Shraddhu , niki , I will soon reply .Aa rahi hoon .

fandom makes a person VERY shallow.. really it does.. it sucks all rational thought and makes them seem stupid. i am not generalising.. but just stating facts..

i have observed 2 fan groups:
one the teenage crowds who idolise these stars and go to stages of madness to stop ALL constructive thought. examples of such: Kitani mohabbat hai: show and actors; KSG, jennifer winget, that irani chick, arjun bijali (or whatever), recently sushant and ankita... i cant list more... these people have a fanbase of young tteeangers who cant think beyond their favs. bas ainvayi they talk..

then comes the older group; older women, who like characters that potray ideals they'd like to have or possess them.. the biggest example is PR. and pratigya

these groups of women effectively make up the psycho fans that stoop to ANY level to "protect their fans"

does it hinder development? i am not sure.. some people are just like that.. they LOVE a lot and LOVE crazily.

plus in some ways, i blame IF itself: they make up RULES that hinder discussion... jsut the other day, in the bollywood forum, a topic was closed as it was a "comparison topic".. if they have such bogus rules, is it ANY wonder that the forums itself are made up of crazy fanatics?

kools: i agree with you.. FANDOM of celebrites is USELESS and POINTLESS.. i personally think its stupid when someone goes crazy for a a person for his/her good looks or "OMG, look.. he is sooo cute"..
i admire FEW people. sushant: for his acting... bas. i too know there are MANY better looking people than sushant, but cant be bothered...
there is NOTHING to be obtained by going to lengths to prove that the star is the best.. nothing...
one: it hurts people. i am guilty of it as well.... when i realised it, i was ashamed of it and swore to never do it... i have seen it happen to varsha n countless others, who now i realise have had a valid point.
why i dont like fandom? because, if a celeb is popular it shows up in TRPs and box office collections. if an actor/actress is not good, it shows up in TRPS and box office collections.. so this "side-business" i dont like.

koolsadhu1000 wrote:

Guys please don't mention members names from any forum . If u want to relate a specific esperience to prove ur point use alphabets XYZ or ABC .Bas .

I m sorry di , aga ajun hi raag yeto mala ticha

A doubt from my side:

Is the discussion about fandom in general or only about fandom in IF and its effects?

Cos everyone is discussing about that only. Everyone is speaking with reference to TV stars of IF only and the bad they have suffered bcos of it.

We all love some or the other stars like Lata Mangeshkar, Amir Khan, Vidya Balan, Sachin Tendulkar etc. Are we not their fans? How are people claiming to be complete non-fans here? Or do they mean to say that they are not fans of any TV actor, which is what is being discussed here? Actually is that what is being discussed here?

Why is this topic being discussed with reference to IF and TV stars ONLY and not in general perspective? (like I included examples of Rajeev and Salman Khan also and spoke about fandom in general. Similarily there are examples of crazy fandom outside IF also- like people who protest just cos someone said something against a star- usually Amitabh Bachchan. On the other hand there are also incidents when fandom has actually led people to support their favourites when they were wrong- they fought for them cos they felt attached to them- they wouldn't have done it for any aira gaira.)

The way everyone prayed for Amitabh Bachchan when he was in hospital fighting life and death is heartwarming. The reactions Amir Khan received, both positive and negative, from his fans owing to some controversies, shows that fans can be fair too.

I'm sorry if I sound rude or confused, I don't intend to, but seriously I cannot understand the motion of discussion now.

Can someone clear it for me, please?

Niki to your Question as I brought up IF in my post..IF isfirst & the largest forum I have been on for past 5-6 yrs and experienced such. I have been to Orkut or other smaller forum which is not comparable. Hope this explains. Even if I remove IF name it still pertains to that forum only.

People can only write about the experiences they have had.

No offense taken. Or no one should take offense to others posts either as this forum allows one to write honestly and candidly

In my whole life there is one person I have been die hard supporter of because I simply love his mere existance on Basket ball court. I love the ethics that he plays with. His determination and discipline, mental strength to turn each negative into positive and rise abv the situation.. My one and only Me Man Chicago Bulls # 23 Michael Jordan. I love him as a BB player and his work ethics. If there is any controversy abt him I wont defend him that is just for an example. I can remain objective about who I love & support.

But but I will never ever have a fight with anyone over him..

Tunde tunde matir bhinna..Everyone has their choice of who to like-love or not.

I dont believe in convincing any one of my view point. I believe in wrtiing what I believe and move on. It does not matter if any one agrees with me on that or not. It is irrelevant to me. I am not looking for any approval

I have seen people going out of control in defending and fighting because they love one celeb for his-her looks. They will support him-her for anything and everything. To the point that celeb is not good at all in other things.

There is a thin grey line between being a fan and Fanatic. Its a journey that a person takes when He/She goes from Fan to fanatic..

I do not personally get attached to anyone by being so involced to the extent I will fight with people.

Kools, Varsha di, you say that you like some people a lot. But you are saying you are not their fan. How?? Can one not be a fan of one aspect of the celeb's life only?

One can be a fan of some person's acting only. I am a fan of many writers even though I don't know about them. I like them for just that - writing. A fan need not be necessarily involved in the celeb's personal life. A fan is not necessarily one who loves the celeb like crazy or one who defends him like crazy. A fan can also be one who likes a star and is interested in his or her life/body of work/ future develoment etc.

Amir Khan has a large number of fans who know little of his life bcos he does not reveal much of it. He has fans bcos of his acting and his choice of movies. He doesn't have fanatics. Those are fans.

People like Amitabh Bacchan have fanatics who build a temple for him and treat him next to God.

People like Sachin Tendulkar have fans and fanatics. They are fans of him only bcos of one thing- CRICKET. They cheer him, encourage him, want to be like him, but when he doesn't play well for a few matches, these same people burn his posters. This is bcos they are fans of his cricketing skills basically. Still they are HIS fans.

For those who say it is destructive to be a fan simply cos you start trying to be like the person-- for a moment, come out of the world of PR and Pratigya and look around.

People do not get influenced only by stupid characters like Pratigya and PR by being their fans-- they also get heavily influenced by the good in a star.

Sachin Tendulkar has inspired a LOT of people all over the world to take up cricket-- he is an encouragement to them in this form- such was his passion for the game that he left studies midway to concentrate on it. People became his fans first, got inspired and then tried to inculcate what they liked in their star. If he can, why CAN I NOT, is the answer they try to seek. And this same approach has resulted in a host of fine cricketers in our Indian team.

Being a fan, an admirer is the first step to getting inspired. Ask this to MS Dhoni, Yuvraj Singh, Irfan Pathan and others who were carrying Sachin round the field when India won the world cup.

Lets take another example. Music this time.

In a reality show once, Bhimsen Joshi told that every person starts singing by trying to sound like the person he/she likes or is a fan off, and then gradually ends up developing his own style. Like Lata Mangeshkar used to sing like a singer (I'm not getting her name now- very old singer.. something Begum..) and then she gradually developed her own style.

Madhuri Dixit is an idol to most budding actresses- maybe cos she was one of the first to truly struggle coming from a modest background and then make a name for herself. Its not surprising that a film was made on her-- "Main Madhuri Dixit ban-na chahti hun."


Sometimes being a fan is the first step to get truly inspired. It is the first step to a highly constructive beginning. It is just like everything else in the world-- out of control, blind fandom can lead to fanatism and destroy you. But being a fan can also have highly positive effects. One should know what to inculcate from a star he/she adores and what has to be strongly criticised or abhorred. Sushant may have a number of fans, but everyone criticises him for smoking. This is an example of being objective.

So criticise fanatism, not fandom.

Varsha Di, in reality show forums, people will always try to defend their star. Its a competition and people feel that others are trying to pull their star down for nothing. Many people do this mud slinging on other stars in the reality show forums- so it becomes a case of ones bitten twice shy. When someone starts criticising for fair reasons even, the supporters feel he/she is trying to pull the star down for no reason. They become wary and suspectful of even peaceful posts cos of the negativity spread by mudslinging.

I am not defending them, but just trying to point out what happens with some people.

There are also some people on the other hand who are so blind in fan worship that they agree to whatever their star has said without using their brain-- Salman said Sushant is faking injury, and suddenly all of them started cursing Sushant like hell, whereas every newspaper was giving complete medical details, name of doctor consulted (a very reputed one) and his daily progress. The effort was showing in his dance too- he danced with a special big belt for his back, which used to be visible when he raised his arms, peeking through his shirt. But those people ignored it conveniently and carried on Salman Jaap. Why not? Wearing a back belt is the latest fashion statement, right? Similarily taking injections in the spine before dancing is a way to increase dancing skills maybe, hai na?? Their own favourite was not performing well, so they used to criticise Sushant. I have seen people rejoicing when Sushant broke his back, inspite of the fact that their own favourite (Daya) had suffered from such an incident before. No sensitivity from them. I was APPALED AND DISGUSTED.

Reality show forums are more about pulling down another contestant to raise your favourite- that is what I have seen. That gets even peaceful fans on their toes sometimes and makes people mad. That forum sucks your sanity.Reality show forums are complicated, if you ask me. Lots of politics goes on. Some people say good things on the face, but bitch behind the back. I have experienced it from someone I know and I was very hurt when she said I am blind and crazy and write long long posts.

On the other hand, there was also one occasion when some people who have never agreed with me were praising me in their chat club!! (I wasn't stalking, mind you, someone posted the links on the forum and asked us to have a look at the bitchiness.) And there I saw all my 'fans'

First of all, I disagree that a person becomes a fan only if he/she starts probing into the personal life of a celebrity. One can be a fan without it also. I have seen COUNTLESS examples. People many a times become fans of a person due to his merit. My parents are fans of Madhuri Dixit's dancing that they wait to watch when she performs, but they don't care much about her family life. Same with Abdul Kalam, journalists and so on. It is VERY MUCH possible to be a fan due to one reason.

And anyway, what is wrong in trying to know about the personal life of a star? Many people do this not bcos of 'extreme fanatism' but bcos simply they want to know what makes the star tick. They want to know how they achieved fandom and whether it made them happy or did it plunge them into lows. (like it happens with models many a times) Many a times even my Mom likes to read about what Hema Malini does to her skin that she looks so young, and my sister wants to know what sort of exercises, surya namaskars do these people do to look so fit? Its not just unnecessary probing, many people have intention behind it.

And even if there is no intention, so what? There is a line of healthy appreciation and I find nothing wrong in reading what a celebrity likes, his struggle etc. After being involved in a part of their life in a major way by witnessing their acting, their writing, their painting (integral componentc of life) there is nothing wrong in trying to know more as long as it is healthy.

As a medical student Kools, I can actually answer the example you raised about alcohol. But anyway, we'll not get into that.

Many a times it is not possible to set up a measure of everything- how much should you pamper, how much should you be strict with kids, and so on. Even in medicine, where you have values for many things, there is no proper demarcated value for insomnia or sleep sickness. The general rule here, and in many other situations is-- when the situation tends ot cross the line of normalcy and you feel things getting destructive to you- wasting of time, energy, resources, health, peace of mind and so on. And one amongst the above everyone can estimate sooner or later. Those who don't end up being the fanatic bunch. A good fan realises when he/she is crossing the limit and buckles out. Like I left PR when I felt it was but a waste of time, and I was losing my sanity on that forum.

koolsadhu1000 wrote:

Its not about PR and Pratigya . I cud easily talk to u on a variety of subjects where I encountered this fandom . But Since we actively see PR ............Why were people so elated about Sushant proposing to Ankita on TV ? What does it have anything to do about his dancing skills in that particular show ? What does it have ANYthing to do with his acting as Manav in PAvitra Rishta ?

Yet people were crazily talking about it or thrilled about it in BOTH forums ............JDJ and PR . Omg Omg Sushant Proposed to Anki ! Omg Omg Omg ! Why ?? So he proposed .....so what ???? How does it affect US ? Is it our wedding ? Has he proposed to US ? Is he gonna dance well due to that proposal ? Or is he gonna act better ? Infact if u guys stop and think ...........Why propose on national TV ? Is it the latest style ? The IN thing ? Is it publicity gimmick ? Is it attempt to become more popular , to gain more votes ? WHAT is it ? Why ARE these stunts done on national TV as ' spontaneous' actions ?

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It has nothing to do with being a fan. People on JDJ forum who were supporting other contestants too said that the proposal was something very sweet. Whether it was real or not nobody knows, but it looked real, looked sweet and they looked very much in love and adorable together. People like to see real life fairytales in front of them which gives positivity and can't help admiring it. Everyone likes to see a happy couple in love. Everything is not done for ones own personal gain-- 'how does it affect us' -- sometimes its just nice to see someone happy.

Another approach--- So what if it was scripted? So what if it was nakli? The bottomline is- We got entertainment right there, right then.. that's it! Enjoy it na! Again that has nothing to do with being a fan.

A third, practical approach---- MUST involve reasoning from all parameters, not one or two: The guy was dancing well anyway and always got votes- so they wouldn't have done it for votes. They are popular too. Maybe the channel told them. Who knows what goes on behind closed doors..

It was basically a love story unfolding on screen slowly and slowly in JDJ, thanks to the prodding of the hosts in every episode, with both the actors opening up slowly and finally came the climax. It was like a story whose happy ending you witnessed, and more than for the actors, people were actually happy at this happy ending of a romantic tale.

Having a rationalized, all rounded view of things goes a long way in being a good fan. It isn't necessarily destructive

It was basically a love story unfolding on screen slowly and slowly in JDJ, thanks to the prodding of the hosts in every episode, with both the actors opening up slowly and finally came the climax. It was like a story whose happy ending you witnessed, and more than for the actors, people were actually happy at this happy ending of a romantic tale.



Differ here strongly . Exactly how many 'love stories' do these stars have ? Neither is Ankita Sushant's first love nor is HE her first 'LOVE" . So what 'love story' unfolded ? May we expect that in two years on another show they have broken up and she is being proposed to by another LOVER in the making ? Thers a perfect possibility isn't there ? After all its the generation of today who give bold interviews that premarital sex is ok and believe in break ups after break ups till they find the right partner . Don't mind darling , just my opinion .

koolsadhu1000 wrote:

It was basically a love story unfolding on screen slowly and slowly in JDJ, thanks to the prodding of the hosts in every episode, with both the actors opening up slowly and finally came the climax. It was like a story whose happy ending you witnessed, and more than for the actors, people were actually happy at this happy ending of a romantic tale.



Differ here strongly . Exactly how many 'love stories' do these stars have ? Neither is Ankita Sushant's first love nor is HE her first 'LOVE" . So what 'love story' unfolded ? May we expect that in two years on another show they have broken up and she is being proposed to by another LOVER in the making ? Thers a perfect possibility isn't there ? After all its the generation of today who give bold interviews that premarital sex is ok and believe in break ups after break ups till they find the right partner . Don't mind darling , just my opinion .

Kools you have not got my point here, I think. I'm saying that even for a viewer who does not know anything of both of them, the way the hosts projected it, it looked like a love story. Right from the first episode- first they were reluctant to speak, then slowly spoke, started opening up, behaved like naughty kids and then finally proposed. Who cares they have done all this before or not? What has all this got to do here? Viewers at that point enjoyed what they were seeing on screen. Point is, the viewers got to see a STORY of sorts- like a romantic film, which involved them and then there was a happy climax. That's it. It has got nothing of 'fan wala' thing. And so what if they have done all this previously, is waqt khush hai na dono? Right now they are in love na? Then wish them the best and hopefully they will be together all along, rather than thinking- agle saal fir break up ho jayega.

People go through break ups and we do not have a right to judge them as fake or real or their love as true/false only on the basis of what little we know and dismiss them bcos of it. Why not wish them luck and be happy for them instead of thinking 'dono nautanki hain?'

If one is not skeptical and choose to give others the benefit of doubt and is glad for them, why must he/she be labelled as 'fan' in the derogatory sense?

has got nothing of 'fan wala' thing. And so what if they have done all this previously, is waqt khush hai na dono? Right now they are in love na? Then wish them the best and hopefully they will be together all along, rather than thinking- agle saal fir break up ho jayega.

People go through break ups and we do not have a right to judge them as fake or real or their love as true/false only on the basis of what little we know and dismiss them bcos of it. Why not wish them luck and be happy for them instead of thinking 'dono nautanki hain?'

If one is not skeptical and choose to give others the benefit of doubt and is glad for them, why must he/she be labelled as 'fan' in the derogatory sense?

It has EVERYTHING to do with the FAN WALA thing only . Because they play on FAN mentality and aim at getting MORE fans by showing such Nakli Love Stories unfolded on screen . I am NOT saying their feelings for each other are nakli ..............they may be a couple off screen like Amitabh Jaya and May at this point intend to marry in the future . That part may be true . But What is shown in REALITY shows .............these proposals , these 'l spontaneous love stories' are extremely contrived and done with only one purpose ..........VOTES and MONEY . When one decides to cash on his love interest in real life , he is being PRACTICAL , not LOVE DOVEY . Amitabh cashed on his the rumors of his affair with Rekha by pitting his wife against her in SILSILA . The movie made MONEY for him . Its all about nothing but MONEY . Now don't ask me is that bad Kools . Im not saying ANYTHING is bad or good , Im only telling what I like or dont like and Why I like and Why I dont like .

Also I really really don't know WHY fans jump when a opinion is given and say its 'not fair to judge them ' on the basis of the little we know and cannot we just wish them the best instead of thinking it is a nautanki . I have been waiting to comment on this statement for a long time now coz I constantly read it in reality show forums . First and foremost ............IT IS fair to comment , it shud NOT be regareded as JUDGING at all . They are acting on shows for PUBLIC and PUBLIC toh comment KAREGI . When fans can believe in them and think the best of them on the basis of the little THEY KNOW , without knowing about ANYTHING that happens in the brutally competitiveand ugly world of Stardom ..........its not called 'JUDGING POSITIVELY" but when others opine contrarily its called "JUDGING" . Why may I know ? In both cases its not JUDGING ................I think we must do away with this term . In both cases its simply an OPINION , BAS . One opinion cannot be hailed as positive and other opinion shud not be called as 'JUDGING" .

Secondly , Who says that those who opine that this is a publicity stunt do NOT wish them well on a personal level ? I say that these things r purely publicity stunts and yet I wish them the best personally if they r a couple backscreen . I have nothing against them personally to wish them ill on any level . Who ARE they to wish them ill ? My enemies ? Hell i don't even KNOW them . I am sure , many elders like me or Varsha etc who opine that perhaps this is a publicity stunt do NOT wish them ill on personal level AT ALL . I wish em the best .

Then about the 'DONO NOUTANKI HAI >" ...........We call it that coz it IS that is our gut feeling . Our experience of life bas . Am not 22 , idealistic , naive or positive . Seen bitter life , bad duniya , all that glitters aint gold and story of styardom behind doors is far diffrent from anything shown on screen is what I observe . Its MY personal observation . If u star guys do noutanki of ur feelings on public channels , noutanki hai kya nahi hai yeh doubt toh aayega hi na ? We r perfectly justified in feeling it is DRAMA coz it was DONE IN DRAMATIC WAY . Thats all .

No hard feelings ha , this is just a debate . Im enjoying it . Here u can speak ur heart out . So simply enjoy it , plzz dont think KOOLS is trying to put u down vown .

kools, I think this debate is going in a different direction. It is becoming a JDJ and Sushita debate when it was actually about something else.

About your first point--- we are discussing different issues. I am speaking about viewer mentality, that a viewer does not get attached to the love story and proposal if he is only a fan. You are saying THE CELEBS DO IT TO ATTRACT FANS. Arey these are two separate issues.

I only spoke that is not like only fans liked the proposal and stuff. Many people liked it, regardless of whether they were fans or not.

Now whether it was done BY CELEBS with the purpose of gaining fan eyeballs or not is a different issue. Here we are discussing whether fandom is constructive or destructive to US or not, hai na? Arey they are doing it for whatever reason, hamara nuksaan to nahi ho raha hai na? Then why worry?

Secondly I do not have a problem if people decide to judge, but frankly speaking, to judge, ALL aspects should be taken into consideration. If one decides to judge, it is must be done taking into consideration the history of the two actors at least on the show, their previous interviews, the positives, the negatives, behavior on the show so far etc etc. THIS I don't see. People are quick to point out that the proposal might have been for publicity or may have been a gimmick, but what they conveniently ignore is that these two same actors had not been so open in the initial weeks of the show. They had been quiet and not spoken about their relationship even when the hosts and judges had teased them. Kyun, tab nahi chahiye thi publicity? Achanak ab bol diya toh publicity stunt? In the last two years, they have never done anything like that ever... at least one can give some consideration to this also. I do not find people doing it. People chose to pass their verdicts on the basis of one single accident which I find highly unfair. And then when we try to defend, we are warded off as blind fans, which is again highly unfair in my opinion. One needs to be careful while passing a judgement of sort- sure, be judgemental if you want to, but only when you have followed at least the story fully. A star is reclusive, does not speak much, stays away from limelight, concentrates on work, if he says or does something unexpected, then his background should be looked into first, it should not be passed off as a publicity stunt A few days back Lata Mangeshkar had also made a statement of sort, and someone called it a publicity stunt. The media slammed him down, saying first look at whom you are speaking about.

We cannot judge people by one incident, as it is we hardly get to know the full details of what goes on behind the screens.

I do not have a problem with JUDGING, I ahve a problem with judging characters when they themselves say 'I don't know, I have not seen whole show.' Then how can you pass a conclusive judgement- they are fake, she is arrogant etc etc. And its not just about negative judgement, the rules are the same for positive judgement too.

People are quick to accuse, but they never give benefit of doubt in even the most sensitive situations. Sushant was not given benefit of doubt even though reports of his injury where coming in the papers again and again. People were saying point blank that he is faking his injury. He was not given BOD when he decided to dedicate a dance to his mother (even though he had already told long ago that he wanted to give his Mom a tribute of some sort), people claimed he used his dead mother for sympathy votes, whereas he didnt even say anything about his Mom, it was the hosts who prodded him to speak and asked him questions. No one gives BOD and when we, who have different POV try to defend, then we are warded off as crazy fans. Arey I gave BOD to Rakhi Sawant also when she cried out on stage once while speaking about her ex-BF, whereas I am no fan of Rakhi Sawant. So what does that mean?

Its not just a fan wala thing. Its about tendency in general.

You do not need to repeat to me not to take offence again and again Kools. But yes, I must say that this debate is going in circles. We have deviated from main topic.

And one more thing- I never said that by calling it nautanki, one wishes ill. But all I was wondering aloud is why does the negative thought come to mind first. People jump with accusations and negative opinions but never give the slightest benefit of doubt even in sensitive situations like remembering a dead mother. Agreed that this is showbiz, and yahan everyone has a motive, but at the end of the day they are all human beings too... why are celebs never judged from that viewpoint too? Why, if a celeb breaks down remembering his Mom on national TV, it is called nautanki, but why when a normal person does it, everyone sympathises? Why only the negative thought first, why not a slight benefit of doubt?

Why, if a celeb breaks down remembering his Mom on national TV, it is called nautanki, but why when a normal person does it, everyone sympathises? Why only the negative thought first, why not a slight benefit of doubt?

I'll tell u why . Coz they are ACTORS . They CAN ACT . Normal person generally CAN"T . { Notice ...........I am using the word generally . Exceptional cases are there .} Point is , ACTING is their bread butter , they do it day in and out . Boo Hoo Hoo comes easily to them . Showing flamboyant love Comes easily to them . So does blushing . If a simple person on a Kiran Bedi show bursts into tears , People will tend to click tongue in sympathy . But if an actor does it , if 50% click tongue in sympathy , there are the other 50% who DON"T but look on with raised eyebrows . It has to be remembered that these are the guys who have moved the nation by flooding in tears over fake Moms in serials and movies equally convincingly . So if the outlook of young positive minded youngsters like you is Oh aren't they human beings lets give them benefit of doubt too ..............the attitude of cynical khusads like me can be ..........Well well , ANYTHING for a moment of fame , isn't it ? Fame is heady . Attempt to build up image CONSTANTLY is competitive . An Actor who weeps for his mother goes down well with crowd . So does an actor in 'love' . The crowd goes Awwwwww .

But speaking on behalf of the cynical khusad gang . Niki we r not so hard boiled and unreasonable also . For instance ......WHERE the actor breaks down also counts . For example if he breaks down while taking an Oscar or a Film fare award by remembering Mom .........I wud NOT , 80% chances here , say he is doing drama . But if he is doing it in reality show setting ...........ummm.......I have seen worst side of human nature so I know My eyebrows might rise .

this does NOT mean Sushant and SRK act each time they remember moms and shed tears . Thats NOT what Im saying .

No the discussion is NOT going haywire . What has happened is I am replying point to point . One long answer is not possible .There r many points in ur answer To my post before this nautanki thing u asked ...............I am coming to them and I will prove from my end how I feel fandom does NOTHING productive .

Secondly I do not have a problem if people decide to judge, but frankly speaking, to judge, ALL aspects should be taken into consideration. If one decides to judge, it is must be done taking into consideration the history of the two actors at least on the show, their previous interviews, the positives, the negatives, behavior on the show so far etc etc. THIS I don't see. People are quick to point out that the proposal might have been for publicity or may have been a gimmick, but what they conveniently ignore is that these two same actors had not been so open in the initial weeks of the show. They had been quiet and not spoken about their relationship even when the hosts and judges had teased them. Kyun, tab nahi chahiye thi publicity? Achanak ab bol diya toh publicity stunt

I have a problem but its exactly ULTA .

I have a problem with us being labelled as 'judgemental' . I object to that term . No Im NOT talking of Sushita or JDJ here . I am talking in general only . I noticed this argument in many forums and it is typically advanced by fans . They do not like being called blind fans. But they Hae zero problem calling others judgemental . And why ? Simply coz the opinion presented is a critique of their idol . The opposite faction actually dares to cast a doubt on the actions of their idol . So it becomes judgemental and negative minded while the fans become the positive torch bearers .

Anything public .........in the entertainment business INVITES judgements from ALL and SUNDRY . Even the fans r judging only ..........the only difference is they are judging FAVOURABLY . Saying that Our Judgement is positive and urs is UNFAIR is totally a subjective point of view .

The term ' judgemental ' has a negative tone to it . I prefer the term opinion only ........in BOTH cases . Positive or otherwise . A differing opinion need not be judgemental and a positive opinion need not be necessarily fair .

I do NOT see why the fact that the two actors have been lying low for quite some time about their personal life should diminish the possibility that they proposed for gaining votes or publicity . So they lay low uptill now , may be they were breaking with their respective ex flames as they had moved on to greener pastures and found new flames . May be they did not get SUCH a platform where they came together this way . Maybe they Got the opportunity NOW . Whats to stop them from grabbing it NOW ? Theres no compulsion that what they did in last two years only will be done in the next four years is there ? Infact as their popularity grows they will jump from square to square like they play hop scotch game . So many things will CHANGE , won't they ?

I also do not see WHY one has to be meticulously informed about many many details of the celebrity's life before he gives an opinion on what he currently sees . I may have said I dont watch reality shows in details and I may not have followed up the antics of Sushita backscreen in detail ...........but that does NOT disqualify me from passing an opinion on Ankita Lokande if I observe her being slightly disrespectful to Madhuri dixit in JDJ . I really don't need to have a dossier of her past interviews , shows , record for that . I put on my TV and see that segment and what do I see ? A star .........just one serial old , being pretty sassy in front of a senior lady like Madhuri . Thats enough for me . Her way of talking , body language , displeased face says it all . Why the hell wud People like me be interested in knowing mORE about this new starlet ? Im not her fan . I really dont have time to read all that history . I merely see , And I comment as Im the average viewer . Are viewers like me not qualified to comment ? Says who ? { this is not for u . This is a general question Im voicing aloud]

The fact is ......People watch , people comment on what people see . The body language in those 15 minutes , Some knowledge of Madhuri who is far more known than Ankita and certain hard fast ideas of decorum values is enough for them to form an opinion . Nothing wrong in that . They are perfectly entitled to it is My opinion . Not everyone has the time and energy to follow up on every interview given by the actress . If at all , its the actress's responsibility to be on her toes behaviour wise on EVERY moment of a show watched nation wide . She should not give an opportunity for tongues to wag about her PR skills .

And this is exactly the crux of my argument .........that fandom limits this objectivity to allow others to have a contrary opinion by giving this reason that others are not qualified to opine so and so as they don't know so much in detail about these idols as WE DO , as WE HAVE BEEN FOLLOWING . How dare they JUDGE is the outcry . And in my opinion ............THATS judgemental . Btw Niks am going now for a boat cruise on the river .

Kools, yeh to aap mera hi argument reverse kar rahe ho... I only told above that okay provide opinions, but if your opinions don't match with ours then don't call us crazy fans. A number of people, (including some who know me well) called me blind and crazy just bcos I defended Sushant. There was nothing 'fanlike' in my argument. As I pointed above, I would have defended even Rakhi Sawant if she had done like that.

I have a big problem with people assuming fans to be crazy only, and thinking that if they anything in favour of their stars, they are biased, if not, they are fair. This is how the mentality is. Everytime I speak positively of Sushant and give him benefit of doubt, people call it fan craze. May I know why? Others opinion is opinion, our opinion is fan craze.

I didnt use the term 'opinion' DELIBERATELY above. Its okay to have an opinion on a person/celeb whatever, in fact there's nothing like MAKING an opinion, it gets formed automatically by itself, but one thing to become judgemental. A judgemental person does not accept others defences of the same and jumps to conclusions quickly. Yes, people can make opinions on a minute by minute exposure/encounter, but opinion of a person can CHANGE with time as and when he/she comes to know the celeb better. People's opinions about Ankita's arrogance didn't change even when 1000 proofs and examples of her much better, sporting behavior were presented by us IN THE SAME SHOW. For two minutes of INSTIGATED anger (by the channel) in a WEAK moment, people hated her like hell. And all those who were questioning the proposal as a PUBLICITY STUNT saying they are 'objective', why don't they question this Ankita's AVI as a TRP raising stunt too? (I am not saying it was, but I'm going by your logic here) There are so many reasons in favour of it also:

1.) Sony and JDJ have fuelled many fights in the previous seasons. Every season of JDJ has had controversy. In fact JDJ MILKS controversy for TRP
2.) No such questions were asked and no such videos were displayed when other contestants left. Why only Ankita?
3.) Why were the other contestants so diplomatically cool and the judges too? Not one seemed to take any kind of offence?
4.) REALITY SHOWS ARE OFTEN SCRIPTED.
5.) The matter was not reported or followed up in papers. If it was real, we would have got some gossip about bitching by the co-contestants and some other articles, or articles qeustioning Ankita about the same. Nothing at all. It looked more like a failed attempt by the channel to raise eyeballs.

Who knew that Avi part was scripted too? Who knows the channel asked Ankita to do it? THAT aspect is never considered by people, and when we try and point it out and ask people to judge from ALL parameters, then we are dismissed it off as crazy fans who are blind in their fan devotion and cannot look beyond their star. Now tell what do I call this? An opinion? Or a judgement?

It takes strength to be objective, but it takes greater strength to give respect to someone else's opinion, especially if he/she is a fan. THIS I don't find. People are quick to ward off the blame of being judgemental and accuse the other party, but do they seriously consider the opinions of the fans. From what I have experienced-NO. 90% times the opinions of fans is never considered, or respected, even if they make valid points. NOW that is what I call being judgemental too, declaring beforehand that oh she's a fan, she will always favour him, so the logic in her argument is BS. THIS is judgemental too.

You said you felt bad just cos I used the term judgemental. I'll tell you what irritates me-- a fan is ALWAYS considered non-objective and partial, even when he/she uses logic in his defence. I ahve faced it everywhere, many others like Tiya, TB Anu have also faced it. People feel hurt when they are called judgemental, but they have no problem in dismissing someone as a fangirl or a crazy fan, just bcos our opinion didn't match theirs. In fact, the opening post itself said-- being a fan limits your vision. (yeh to for granted le liya hai.)

Being non-objective doens't necessarily mean that the logic or opinion is necessarily right- even non-fans can have lots of differences in opinions over the same thing. Similarily being a fan doesn't necessarily mean being unfair. And it is this which I find judgemental- making opinions too quickly and not willing to change them even when others provide logical arguments. Opinions do change with time.

Enjoy the boat ride.